We tried to book a campsite in APP this year 5 months in advance for the first time ever. We had to push our trip back by 3 weeks. We had 3 computers running 2-3 internet tabs each, each with a different campsite open. All we had to do was click RESERVE at precisely 7am. With this methods trying 10+ campsites every single day we finally scored one of the best campground sites in the park at Pog Lake on the river (after trying every morning for 3 weeks).
I can tell you one thing... I know a little computer programming and I was very very tempted to make a program to just input what campsites you want it to book then at 7am it automatically tries to book every site on the list. If I try to reserve 100+ sites per morning im bound to get something..

Last edited by ATVenture (3/31/2021 5:47 am)

TripperMike wrote:

ATVenture wrote:

We tried to book a campsite in APP this year 5 months in advance for the first time ever. We had to push our trip back by 3 weeks. We had 3 computers running 2-3 internet tabs each, each with a different campsite open. All we had to do was click RESERVE at precisely 7am. With this methods trying 10+ campsites every single day we finally scored one of the best campground sites in the park at Pog Lake on the river (after trying every morning for 3 weeks).
I can tell you one thing... I know a little computer programming and I was very very tempted to make a program to just input what campsites you want it to book then at 7am it automatically tries to book every site on the list. If I try to reserve 100+ sites per morning im bound to get something..

I had the same issue trying to book front country for the fam at Grundy, Killarney, Bon Echo etc.  All of the good waterfront or walk in sites would be open, hit reserve, page loads for a while, then get a message saying there is no availability.  Ended up getting a walk in at Silent Lake after about 8 days of trying.  It will be interesting to see how many cancellations start popping up throughout July and August. 

Hopefully that's a good point.  The Gov't would lose money by offering all these large reservations up only to cancel without a large fee.  Could be that last minute is the way to book this year, just pulling the trigger with a go-bag ready.

With the early-season moratorium on permits in APP, our ice-out trip is going to be at Kawartha Highlands this year.  At least there you can still book a per person rate (for now). 
 

The competition aspect is definitely part of it.  Like with toilet paper last year, articles talking about increased demand does cause people to worry about it.  I usually book mt trips around two weeks in advance but I've already booked 8 nights in July and 10 nights in August.

But clearly there are people gaming the system for profit and that sucks.  Outfitters booking big chunks annoys me but people selling for profit is way worse (whether by not or not)

Last edited by keg (4/03/2021 10:46 am)

I am sad. The backcountry should be a place where souls are to be free.  It is not a place to be commercialized.  I understand our need to be connected at this time.  At the expense of the individual a cost to be had upon the soloist who has a yearning and burning for their very soul.

I’m not sure I would say kudos to them. I’m certain there is nothing illegal but as with many things in life just because you can do something does not mean you should.

It’s very clearly manipulation of the system and my experience is that it will likely lead to unintended consequences. Those consequences will likely not impact all of us, but they probably won’t be well received.

PaPaddler wrote:

Is the practice of booking a site and re-selling as an outfitter or as a citizen illegal?  If not, kudos to those who show initiative and motivation to work within the law; if it is illegal, they should be prosecuted.

Are you serious?  Whether it is legal or not, using automation to purchase prime campsites for profit while leaving the regular user barely a chance of securing one at all is a bullshit practice, especially with the uptick in bookings over the last 12 months.  It took over a week of daily booking attempts to get a decent front country spot for the family this year, and not even in one of the 'popular' parks.  If you support this, you're either involved in this nonsense or oblivious to how this affects people enjoying the outdoors that may not have the option of a deep back country trip. 

Sure, my opinion may not be popular and the practice is certainly not friendly to all users but the onus of the system design is on the designers to prevent manipulation or mis-use outside of its intended design.  You may freely chastise me for supporting lawful use of a system but I would argue that your position lacks merit if the practice is not illegal.  

If 'scalper bots' are, in fact, illegal and these users are employing them in a manner that is prohibited, I stand by my statement of 'they should be prosecuted'.

I am serious and I am not trolling.  I am pointing out that the system design is potentially at fault for what you all have identified as a distasteful use of the system.  My position is that, unless the activity is prohibited, their actions are legitimate.  I certainly wouldn't do what they are doing (so I am not involved in 'this nonsense'), but I will not admonish someone for working within the limits of the law.  I am also not oblivious to how it affects people - I recognize the impact and respect the rules as established, whether I agree with them or not.

ShawnD wrote:

Pretty sure "scapler bots" were made illegal in Canada a few years ago. If that is in fact what they are doing.

If they are manually booking and reselling at a profit, technically I don't think its illegal.

Agree with TripperMike and his opinion of the practice though.

Bots for this purpose are technically illegal in Canada, but there is a lot of grey area around it that allows these things to continue.  There was a Kijiji add listing sites at Killarney, APP, Grundy, Bon Echo etc. even claiming to be using 'state of the art automation technology' to secure great camp sites for re-sale, so I highly doubt there is anyone going through the labour and trouble to manually book for this purpse. 

As stated by many, ON parks doesn't care as long as they're fully booked out for the season.  Hopefully the recent buzz about this will help with some restrictions in the future. 

@ShawnD - I must have been unclear but I wrote quite the opposite: "you may freely chastise me". 

I personally would not admonish someone for these actions - but I did not imply or write that you should not form your own opinion about their behaviors or restrict your comments in any way.  You are free to write what you would like (as long as it is not slanderous or libel, technically). 

I chose my words carefully as I have been personally lambasted in the recent past for my comments and have opted not to respond in a demeaning or insulting manner...and I would definitely employ anyone else to attempt to introduce new 'rules of conversation' to my wife! ;-)