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2/04/2020 7:52 am  #18


Re: newbie questions

MartinG wrote:

Some people go from Cedar to Burntroot in a day. 

Some people go from Kiosk to Little Osler in one day, we won't point a finger.
 

 

2/04/2020 10:50 am  #19


Re: newbie questions

I would say it is difficult to suggest a route based on a quick description of another group you have never met. I hesitate to make suggestions sometimes...so many variables and you don't want anyone to get into trouble and that's why I went back and mentioned potential wind and wave issues on Cedar.  Issues I have never had myself but I have heard enough about them. I've actually had 2 of my worst paddling issues in AP on Kiosk but that is just the luck of the draw. All things being equal I understand Cedar can be far more dangerous.

For context Ryan the last time I paddle out of Cedar I first drove 5 hours to get there. had an issue that delayed me an additional 45 mins. then paddled from Cedar to Lynx lake which is about an 1 hour further than some good  sites on Catfish. I arrived before 6 pm. That said I have portaged a canoe more than a few times, i was solo and my complete set up was pretty light. I single carried all but a small part of Unicorn Hill.

You will be slower yes but if you are already on Cedar avoiding a long morning drive and travelling a little less distance you should be more than fine..

If you are looking at big waves though at any part of the trip not just if you go out of Cedar.. "when in doubt, don't do it"  is always a good motto..


We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it.
 - George Washington Sears
 

2/05/2020 8:02 am  #20


Re: newbie questions

an easy and usually effective way to avoid waves is to simply plan early starts, an afternoon nap, and late arrivals. winds anywhere in the park generally worsen during the day as the land heats up and the hot air rises, and then decrease again later as the land cools. But there will always be weather patterns that affect all of central Ontario that, on occasion will affect things- best to plan an extra layover day for that.

 

2/11/2020 12:53 pm  #21


Re: newbie questions

Thinking more about starting out at Cedar.  Getting gear at the Brent store seems pretty easy and less of a headache than stopping somewhere else.  

If we decided to head up to the Nipissing River:  How are the campsites from Whiskey Jack back to Cedar?  With our group of 9 I wonder if we will have any decent options.  We likely will be in 3 tents.  

Does anyone have info about lake depths?  

     Thread Starter
 

2/11/2020 1:15 pm  #22


Re: newbie questions

Ryan from Whiskey Jack you could branch off and head up to Nadine (you have extra time with the 8 nights)  

Long Marsh could fit you guys on the Nip too. Nice site.


We do not go to the green woods and crystal waters to rough it, we go to smooth it.
 - George Washington Sears
 

2/15/2020 2:10 pm  #23


Re: newbie questions

Here is what we've decided on with just a few days left before we can reserve our permits:
picking up canoes in Huntsville or Oxtongue (Brent does not have 3 - three-seat canoes so we need to stop anyway).

All my numbers are coming from Jeff's maps online which I realize are old and may not be the most accurate.  I also know timing will vary with our group-some parts we may be faster, most probably slower.  For planning purposes I am thinking of multiplying his times by 1.5 or 2 and I also know that the time on Jeff's maps don't include stops for breaks, meals, fishing, etc...

We decided to  to move between lakes vs. going up to the Nipissing River.  

1. Start at Brent - stay at Ranger Cabin (if possible) to pack, repack, and repack some more.

2. Cedar to Catfish  14.3 km, 5 portages totalling 3610m, 4:40 travel time 

3.Catfish to Hogan, 14km, 3 portages totalling 3700m, 4:10 travel time

4. Hogan to Lake La Muir, 11.1 km, 1 portage totalling 685m, 2:30 travel time

5. Lake La Muir to Big Trout, 9.1km, 1 portage totalling 2590, 2:00 travel time

if a rest or wind is needed we can skip Big Trout and go LaMuir to Burnroot

6. Big Trout to Burntroot, 13.8km, 3 portages totalling 415m, 4:00 travel time

7. Burntroot to Catfish ,17km, 5 portages totalling 1425m, 5:00 travel time

8. Catfish to Cedar or along the Petawawa River near the falls, 13.6km, 5 portages totalling 3610m

9. Cross Cedar (~2 km) and back to Brent, pack cars, return Canoes, drive home

so looking at around 95 km + exploring, fishing, and getting lost a few times I'm sure.

Any feedback would be appreciated-thanks!

     Thread Starter
 

2/15/2020 6:32 pm  #24


Re: newbie questions

I understand that you will be single-carrying, otherwise times do not make sense. Jeff's estimates are  reasonable - on average, of course. I will take day 3 at 4 hours with a grain of salt (but not too big a grain) - these are tough portages, hilly and long. Sunfish could be overgrown with vegetation and re-eally slow late in the season, plus you'll have to paddle Hogan in the afternoon against predominant winds (unless you decide to camp in Parks bay). Altogether it's a perfect loop you are planning. Could be done in 4 longer days if one's in a hurry.

 

2/15/2020 10:38 pm  #25


Re: newbie questions

ryan72 wrote:

... All my numbers are coming from Jeff's maps online which I realize are old and may not be the most accurate...

 You can be assured that Jeff’s numbers are the most accurate. There’s no other comprehensive resource out there that I know about.

Your trip seems very doable. Many of the days look short. I would consider throwing in a longer and more challenging day in there as well as a two night stay at one site, just to see how you’ll like it compared with all the other days. Personally, I hate constantly pitching and breaking camp so I like long travel days and staying on one nice site for as long as possible, which never seems long enough.

 

2/16/2020 9:18 am  #26


Re: newbie questions

EddyTurn wrote:

I understand that you will be single-carrying, otherwise times do not make sense. Jeff's estimates are  reasonable - on average, of course. I will take day 3 at 4 hours with a grain of salt (but not too big a grain) - these are tough portages, hilly and long. Sunfish could be overgrown with vegetation and re-eally slow late in the season, plus you'll have to paddle Hogan in the afternoon against predominant winds (unless you decide to camp in Parks bay). Altogether it's a perfect loop you are planning. Could be done in 4 longer days if one's in a hurry.

yes, we plan on single-carrying as often as possible.  

     Thread Starter
 

2/16/2020 9:22 am  #27


Re: newbie questions

solos wrote:

ryan72 wrote:

... All my numbers are coming from Jeff's maps online which I realize are old and may not be the most accurate...

 You can be assured that Jeff’s numbers are the most accurate. There’s no other comprehensive resource out there that I know about.

Your trip seems very doable. Many of the days look short. I would consider throwing in a longer and more challenging day in there as well as a two night stay at one site, just to see how you’ll like it compared with all the other days. Personally, I hate constantly pitching and breaking camp so I like long travel days and staying on one nice site for as long as possible, which never seems long enough.

Thanks for the idea.  I like setting up camp for 2 nights as well.  We will see how my sons do and might push on if weather cooperates.
 

     Thread Starter
 

2/16/2020 9:35 am  #28


Re: newbie questions

John Connelly wrote:

Hey ryan72  ..... Yer plan sure does sound like a great paddle .
 Would think at the end of trip like that , on the last day , ya might want ta get back ta Cedar fer a bag of chips and a soda pop at the Brent Store .
Just a thought .... as the Whiskeyjack flies , it may not be the quickest way back to Cedar from Catfish less an hour or two , as many would say , but if ya want ta end with a real treat and make that last hour worthwile ... a paddle down the Nip from the Luckless portage is often rewarded with many a view .... a real enjoyable paddle with the current behind pushing ya back ta Cedar . 

thats a great idea.  thanks!  and awesome pics.

     Thread Starter
 

2/16/2020 3:10 pm  #29


Re: newbie questions

Great trip Ryan. I'm not sure I have anything to add that hasn't already been said, but I'll write something anyway!

The only downside to your loop as planned is that your two toughest days are the first two, when you're carrying the full food weight for a lot of people for a long trip. I'm not suggesting you can't do it, but especially with kids just be extra careful to take it easy enroute to Catfish, and then to Hogan. Neither is a particularly long day from a distance perspective, but they won't be fun - a lot of portaging, a lot of climbing, and the route through Sunfish can be a slog in low water conditions. And the campsites on the west end of Hogan are the ones taken first, as they're both nice (for the most part) and along the route most people will be doing. Prepare yourself for possibly having to head to the east end of Hogan to find a site. 

After that your days get much, much, kinder. Big Trout is a big, beautiful lake, but mid-summer it's also one of the premium destinations in the park. You may find yourself paddling the length and breadth of it looking for an open campsite. After the slog of the first two days, I'd suggest you skip Big Trout and either spend two nights on La Muir or on Burntroot. Having time to relax and enjoy where you are, especially after you've earned it, will go over well with everyone (I have a soft spot for La Muir, but Burntroot is the prettier lake with better campsite options). 

For that matter you may want to skip Hogan entirely, and go Catfish to La Muir. While it may seem like that's making a tough day tougher, La Muir means you can scope for campsites while still being on your route, instead of Hogan where you might end up backtracking many kilometers just to find a camp. Then you can easily spend two nights on Burntroot and maybe two nights on Catfish as well. 

 

2/20/2020 11:26 am  #30


Re: newbie questions

Thanks for all of your input and great ideas.  I got the permits reserved yesterday after a long day of getting the spinning blue circle in the reservation system to cooperate with me.

     Thread Starter
 

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