Algonquin Adventures / Solo or Tandem Canoe?

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 1:25 pm

Over the next couple of years I plan on buying a new canoe (the Old Town Discover 158 is just getting too damn heavy). I plan on doing a lot of solo tripping with some tandem trips mixed in as well. For those who have done lots of solo tripping, do you do so in a solo or tandem boat? I've solo'd a tandem canoe several times but never for long distances or across larger lakes. Obvioulsy a tandem boat would be much more versatile for what I'm looking for, but how viable is it to take a tandem boat on an extended solo trip? Keep in mind I usually avoid larger lakes and much prefer small lakes and river systems.

Thanks!

**Posted by MooseWhizzer Dave** 4/13/2020 1:53 pm

Hi Steve - In the past for me it was 100% group trips (usually a group of 2 people). During the past few years I have ventured into solo trips, and I think that will increase some. I don't own a solo however, I just fantasize about it. I need to be able to say "What? That's always been there." with a straight face when my wife asks what that third canoe is in the garage before I can take the plunge.

I have always used a tandem - canoe trips, fishing, evening paddle, everything. It suits the best of both worlds for me except for one thing - weight. I have a Nova Craft Pal that weighs about 58 pounds with the trim package I've got. I can manage it ok, but it would not break my 54-year old heart to portage say a 40 pound solo boat. With any canoe I've ever purchased, all tandems, I have done so knowing it would sometimes be used as a solo, and sometimes as a tandem.

Well, there is another consideration - it does get tiresome in a stiff wind getting the boat pushed off sideways. A solo boat is typically lower in the water, the weight is more cental, there's less surface area to get caught up in wind, so it may be less susceptible to that. Others will probably chime in on that. If you tend to stick to smaller lakes, etc., this may not be much of a concern for you. I've lived with it so far, but I can't say it isn't annoying.

**Posted by BarryB** 4/13/2020 2:06 pm

For solo trips, I use a solo canoe. I got mine circa 2008 .. a Bell Magic 16'. Admittedly it's not in production anymore. However, it's features are what I'm extolling ..

- No keel, which improves steerability
- Good tumblehome to facilitate using a kayak paddle
- Light weight to help on portages (started at 32 pounds, up to 36 with skid plates, etc.)

With its light weight, clean lines and double-blade paddle .. its fast! Admittedly it has initial instability when not loaded, but its secondary stability makes up for that!

The seat is dropped low, which helps with additional stability. And by necessity with the central seat, the yolk is removable.

**Posted by trippythings** 4/13/2020 2:32 pm

Most of my trips are solo and I've only ever used solo canoes for those trips. I have paddled solo in tandem canoes plenty though (when going for solo paddles during group trips), and there's a huge difference in my opinion. I personally wouldn't take the risk of paddling a tandem while solo. I don't mean 'risk' in the sense of danger, more so just getting bullied by the wind, less control of the boat with each stroke, etc. It's just more difficult and makes you more prone to set backs / slower travel. Plus the actual 'risk' of getting windbound more easily.

Tandem is more versatile like you said, but honestly, solos are just way more fun to paddle as well in my opinion. If you're able to live with sacrificing the versatility of the tandem, then go for the solo.

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 3:05 pm

Thanks for the tips guys. I'll have to give some more thought as to how I plan to use the boat most often. There is certainly value in each type but they both seem to have pretty big advantages over one another in other areas....lots to ponder!

**Posted by Jdbonney** 4/13/2020 3:09 pm

Barry, that is a great setup. Nice looking boat.

Steve, get a solo. You won’t regret it.

**Posted by ShawnD** 4/13/2020 3:36 pm

One of each is the right answer if you can swing it Steve. You only live once.

I doubt you will look back in 30 years and say" Gee..I really wish i didn't buy the second canoe"

**Posted by Jdbonney** 4/13/2020 4:31 pm

So next step. Who wants to recommend the best solo canoe?

**Posted by trippythings** 4/13/2020 4:57 pm

Jdbonney wrote:
So next step. Who wants to recommend the best solo canoe?

I probably won't be able to give the best answer (I've paddled 3 or 4 different ones and liked them all) but would be good to include more info like i) how lightweight does it need to be, ii) max budget, iii) type of travel (river / large lakes), etc.

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 5:36 pm

trippythings wrote:
Jdbonney wrote:
So next step. Who wants to recommend the best solo canoe?
I probably won't be able to give the best answer (I've paddled 3 or 4 different ones and liked them all) but would be good to include more info like i) how lightweight does it need to be, ii) max budget, iii) type of travel (river / large lakes), etc.

How about a good boat for someone who does mainly rivers and small lakes, likes to take more gear than the average person, weight under 60 pounds and unlimited budget?

**Posted by trippythings** 4/13/2020 6:01 pm

Steve E wrote:
How about a good boat for someone who does mainly rivers and small lakes, likes to take more gear than the average person, weight under 60 pounds and unlimited budget?

The boats that I've paddled are:

Swfit Keewaydin 15'
Swift Shearwater 16'
H2O Solo 15'

I find the 15' easier to navigate and I have more control of the boat, especially with river travel. But the 16' was a little faster on open water. Obvious tradeoff is less space to carry stuff in the smaller boats, which I find to be quite noticeable with the 1ft difference. The narrow shape of the boat, particularly near the bow and stern (the only places to store gear in a solo) make it more difficult to fit heavy-loaded packs; less of an issue with the 16'. So hard to really recommend if you're doing lots of river travel, but want to carry lots of gear... almost counteracting preferences in a sense.

They're all 30-34lbs as well so I can't comment on any heavier options and what the differences would be.

But I'm no expert when it comes to judging how well canoes track, etc. so take my opinion with a grain of salt... my recommendation is very subjective just based on how I felt paddling the boats. When I rent I'm not too picky, if they have a solo boat available and it's <35lbs, I'll take it.

Not a fan of pack boats... never actually paddled one but I've used a double-blade in a regular solo and I just like the purist feeling of using a traditional canoe paddle, so pack boats don't interest me.

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 6:14 pm

Great info! That's a good point regarding the solo boat being more narrow. So would it be a challenge to fit a fully loaded Seal Line bag in a 15 or 16 foot solo boat? I'm assuming you'd want it in front of you to balance the weight a bit?

**Posted by ShawnD** 4/13/2020 6:20 pm

Based on what I know about you and how you trip Steve. I think you want a boat that can take a lot of abuse. Super speedy likely isn't your top priority. A boat you can load up, drag over beaver dams and is fairly fun to paddle.

If you can get one over the border how about a Northstar Phoenix in IXP ? MartinG could offer you a much better opinion on the boat and if it might be right for you as he owns the smaller version of it.

https://www.cliffcanoe.com/post/2017/10/31/review-northstar-phoenix-canoe

other than that maybe Swifts New Prospector 14 in Expedition Kevlar?

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 6:32 pm

ShawnD wrote:
Based on what I know about you and how you trip Steve. I think you want a boat that can take a lot of abuse. Super speedy likely isn't your top priority. A boat you can load up, drag over beaver dams and is fairly fun to paddle.

You are bang on with that! I don't want to baby my canoe at all ("ramming speed" is often heard as we crash up on shore

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 6:43 pm

Shawn I meant to ask you how you are liking your boat? Did you get it out much this past year?

**Posted by trippythings** 4/13/2020 6:43 pm

Steve E wrote:
Great info! That's a good point regarding the solo boat being more narrow. So would it be a challenge to fit a fully loaded Seal Line bag in a 15 or 16 foot solo boat? I'm assuming you'd want it in front of you to balance the weight a bit?

How big is the bag?

For reference, these are the packs that I use: https://www.amazon.ca/North-49-Norwester-100L-Canoe/dp/B008BKZRLI

If it's packed to the extent shown in the Amazon picture, there are no issues. But there's a black 'extendable' section at the top (not visible in the picture), and if I have it fully loaded including that extra section, it becomes more difficult.

The big difference between the 15' and 16' with those packs is just how snug it fits. In the 15' it's extremely snug (and if the side pockets are loaded it becomes a tad too wide and annoying to load)... so when you're at a non-ideal portage landing and you're trying to load / unload, it can get stuck a little bit within the boat. It fits more nicely in the 16'. But again that's just my experience with those specific packs and how full I load them.

Your comment about in front of me to balance the weight is a funny point to bring up, because it's always a decision I need to make. I travel with 1 of those packs, 1 barrel (got 20L this year, previously was 30L), and 1 tiny day pack. The pack is too big to fit comfortably in front of me in the 15' if I want any sense of leg room... so it goes in the back.

Some pics from a trip last September with the 15' H2O:
https://i.postimg.cc/T12PBpz1/IMG-0017.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/CLFv6Sd2/IMG-9881.jpg
https://i.postimg.cc/VkhD6t4y/IMG-9971.jpg

Of course that 'footrest' (don't know the proper term) can be removed, but still there's more room in the back of the boat, especially since you can squish a couple inches under the bottom of your seat if needed. A couple heavy rocks go a long way in helping distribute weight... whenever I'm going for a paddle after I've set up camp I always weigh down the boat so if winds pick up I don't get thrown around.

**Posted by Steve E** 4/13/2020 6:57 pm

Hmmm I might be best to rent before I splurge on something like this. Might be better to get a feel for how it works for my style of tripping. I don't mind paying good money but I also don't want to have any regrets. Great info so far folks so thank you for all your comments!