Algonquin Adventures / Sad news from Big Trout Lake

http://www.youtube.com/user/kayakcamper · **Posted by Uppa** 8/16/2017 1:26 pm

I just saw on the news: the kid didn't pass the swim test and they let him go anyway. There were two kids who didn't even take the swim test on the trip too.

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2017/08/16/teen-who-drowned-on-school-trip-didnt-pass-swim-test.html

**Posted by Jdbonney** 8/17/2017 11:31 am

The failure isn't that he failed the swim test its failing to ensure he was wearing a life jacket while near the water. There is no requirement to swim on a canoe trip. Its unfortunate that now non swimming kids will probably be prevented from going on a canoe trip when in reality they should just be forced to wear a lifejacket.

**Posted by yellowcanoe** 8/17/2017 12:06 pm

Jdbonney wrote:
The failure isn't that he failed the swim test its failing to ensure he was wearing a life jacket while near the water. There is no requirement to swim on a canoe trip. Its unfortunate that now non swimming kids will probably be prevented from going on a canoe trip when in reality they should just be forced to wear a lifejacket.

It would be unfortunate if youth that did not know how to swim were automatically excluded from outdoor ed canoe trips. Such a policy would disproportionately impact immigrant youth who are less likely to have learned swimming skills than Canadian born youth. I guess I was lucky when I was a Scout leader -- I have no recollection of having a Scout that wasn't able to swim and we did have a few Scouts who had emigrated to Canada.

**Posted by Jdbonney** 8/17/2017 12:25 pm

I'm hopeful that the result is not the exclusion of non swimming kids. We aren't talking about little kids here, these are teens, accompanied and supervised by trained educators, that should know to either wear the life jacket or stay away from the water.

**Posted by scoutergriz** 8/18/2017 7:53 am

as a former scout leader, In my group all participants (over 400 now) had to have either their bronze level certificate, equivalent of it, or pass a swim test that demonstrated equal skills. All trips were also announced several months in advance to allow time to acquire those skills. Over the years I had several kids that either had poor or no swimming ability, my leadership team worked with each to MAKE SURE those youth met the standard.
In 20 years, I've only ever excluded 1 youth who refused to even try (We even taught a few that were hydrophobic). Proper planning and enough time to acquire those skills are what's needed to ensure a safe trip. Those kids also learned navigation, rescue (self and others), emergency 1st aid, wilderness skills, etc.
In the bush, with a 6 to 1 ratio, and all the activity; in 1 minute, you can have tents going up, fire lit, food prep, gear sorting, and myriad other things happening, all requiring adult supervision, and kids being kids, one can easily slip away and fall in without notice. To add non-swimmers to the mix is courting disaster!

**Posted by Antman** 8/20/2017 9:29 am

Are there other regs like having these kids wear a boot on portages - not sandals or other non supporting footwear ? What about axes and who uses them ?

Last edited by Antman (8/20/2017 9:32 am)

**Posted by Jdbonney** 7/26/2018 10:21 am

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/ontario-man-charged-in-death-of-jeremiah-perry-1.4762341

**Posted by boknows** 7/26/2018 11:46 am

I just read this on my computer feed this morning. A teacher on the trip is now charged with criminal negligence involving a student drowning on Big Trout Lake last year. Again, my condolences to the family involved in this tragic event.

**Posted by Jdbonney** 5/11/2021 10:07 am

So the criminal trial for the teacher running this trip has just started.

https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/2021/05/10/if-this-toronto-teacher-had-common-sense-student-jeremiah-perry-15-wouldnt-have-drowned-crown-says-at-start-of-trial.html

**Posted by Jdbonney** 10/06/2021 10:20 am

Teacher was found not guilty today.

**Posted by RobW** 10/06/2021 12:21 pm

CBC article on the ruling:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toronto/nicholas-mills-jeremiah-perry-drowning-tdsb-verdict-1.6201341

**Posted by GordK** 10/09/2021 11:00 pm

A sad incident. While the teacher (Mills) is not criminally liable the Justice certainly provided grounds for a civil suit (ie: "brought his conduct to the level of carelessness," ). I'm sure the civil suit would proceed irrespective of the Justice's comments but carelessness is really at the heart of a lot of concerns I have in the parks these days. Car camping has its own threshold of safety issues and even there competence in swimming or a mandatory life jacket seems like common sense, unless maybe you have a watchful parent/buddy - and this was not car camping. 30+ kids in canoes with a 6:1 ratio on supervision seems, from my removed viewpoint, to be a bad idea. The scope of the trip seems to be more than is warranted. What about something more organized (or perhaps more forgiving) on the shores of LoTR or Mew. I appreciate I don't get the nuance and I appreciate we don't want to over-regulate or simply cancel all trips but there again, if a more careful approach isn't used, lawsuits will end the trips anyway.

Last edited by GordK (10/09/2021 11:01 pm)